'All of us are descendants of Harappans': Archaeologist Vasant Shinde

Archaeologist Vasant Shinde led the excavation of Rakhigarhi (Haryana) and co-authored two landmark papers published in Cell and Science, in 2019, based on the DNA analysis of a 4,500-year-old female skeleton recovered from the site. The study grabbed eyeballs as it provided the first genetic insights into our ancestry, and the findings were included in NCERT textbooks. However, it also sparked a debate, with some scholars being divided over the interpretation of the data, especially in relation to the contentious Aryan invasion or migration theory.

Shinde, who also served as the vice-chancellor of Deccan College, is overseeing the establishment of a national maritime museum in Lothal, a massive project expected to open within a year. In an interview with THE WEEK, Shinde spoke about the significance of Rakhigarhi, its most famous woman and addressed lingering doubts about the findings. Excerpts:

Q/ Why is Rakhigarhi so important?

A/ There was no clear idea about the size of Rakhigarhi before our excavations. The site is spread over 500 ha, which is double the size of the biggest known Harappan city of Mohenjo-daro.

When Bhiranna (also in Haryana) was excavated, it [was found that] its antiquity was 6,000 years old, but there was criticism, mostly from foreigners, that it cannot be that old. So, we accepted the challenge.

After excavating other sites, we came to Rakhigarhi. Now we know that the beginning of the Harappan culture goes back to 6000 BCE. This is important because we did not have such early dates earlier.... The Harappan culture was growing simultaneously in all regions, and there was no one particular centre as such. We always knew that it emerged from the earlier Harappan phase, but we did not know how the transformation took place. How the material culture has transformed.

Q/ What answers did Rakhigarhi provide?

A/ We found good evidence of the gradual growth of the Harappan city.... In the case of architecture, we found that they began with simple, circular pit dwellings. Four or five dwellings formed a cluster. So each one used for a different purpose, be it for sleeping, as a kitchen or for storage. This is how they started in 6000 BCE.

In the next level, maybe in around 5500 BCE, they continued to build circular huts but not underground. Then in the third phase, we find proper rectangular Harappan structures. So we find that the Harappans started using building material like bricks in proper ratios, [and they had] toilets, bathrooms and even tandoors. In the fourth stage, there is some modicum of planning as structures are arranged in a linear pattern, and roads and streets started coming up. In the fifth phase, full-fledged townships emerge.

Similarly, in the case of ceramics, the pottery we found in the lower level was handmade, coarse, not well finished, not well painted. Gradually, the pottery got refined. By 2600 BCE, it becomes classical pottery.

Q/ What does Rakhigarhi tell us about its people?

A/ The only way we can know [their life] is to get their DNA, study their genetic history. Who were these people? Some scholars said Harappans came from outside and developed the cities. Some said they were indigenous people. But scientifically, nothing was proved. We could tackle only one issue, the other is about the script, which was not deciphered and is an ongoing issue. Our purpose in Rakhigarhi was to study its people through their DNA.

Q/ How did the process of DNA extraction happen?

A/ I excavated the site of Farmana [in Haryana] in 2006.... We did not know what precautions to take while collecting samples. We dug up 70 burials at once and kept them open for two months. So whatever DNA was there, escaped. Subsequently, I came in contact with some Korean geneticists, who then guided us to make sure that there was no contamination. We used PPE kits and different tools for each burial.

But when we analysed the DNA, surprisingly, we found some elements of East Asian people. The Harappans never had contact with that region. Then we realised that one of our students involved in excavation was from Korea. So sensitive is the DNA.

Q/ Then how were you successful?

A/ We excavated 60 burials in Rakhigarhi. In 59, we did not find anything, because the climate in India is not conducive for the preservation of organic matter, including DNA. Then we analysed the last sample. And surprisingly, we found a good amount of authentic DNA. She was 35 years old.

We took the help of scientists from different institutes like CCMB (Centre for Cellular and Molecular Biology), Harvard and labs in Korea. We also realised that if only Indians published the study, international scholars would again doubt it. We published the results in September 2019. In November, at an international conference in China, they recognised our research as one of nine breakthrough research [papers] worldwide.

Q/ What more do we know about the Rakhigarhi woman?

A/ She was from an affluent family as we found a lot of burial pots around. She was a good-looking woman because her features are sharp. She was tall, maybe around five and a half to six feet. She was well-built like modern Haryana women.

Q/ Can you take us through the study’s major findings?

A/ It took us back almost 12,000 years, [when] hunter-gatherers somewhere in Northwest [Asia] split into two groups; one came to South Asia and one went to Iran. Both of them had common ancestry, so you find some [similarity in] genes between the early population in Iran and India.

But where the [first group] went, they mixed with the Anatolian (modern-day Turkey) people. The group that came here remained independent. And their genes started getting mutated. It formed what we call ancient ancestral South Asian [genes]. Those were the distinctive genes of the Harappans and Indians.

Q/ What do you mean by Harappan and Indian genes?

A/ So, now we know that these were the Indian people. For the past 12,000
years, there is no discontinuity in our genetic history. But at the same time, we find some mixing of genes from different regions.... 25 to 30 per cent genes found in the Harrapan people were ancient ancestral South Asian genes, the genes of the Indians. Then perhaps 2 per cent Central Asian, 3 per cent Iranian; these people had contact with these regions, so genes got mixed up. The process continues till today. The strong indication that we are getting from this research is that the majority populations of South Asia have the same source. So all of us, right now, no matter the religion or language, we are the descendants of the Harappans.

Q/ But people in India look so different from north to south.

A/ Genes have nothing to do with that. It has to do with geography, climate,
food habits and with whom the mixing was happening more. For example, the people from the south mixed more with Southeast Asian people. They have still preserved more African genes. So because of that, they look different. People from the northern part have more affinity with Iran and Central Asia.

Q/ You had talked about the Aryan issue after the study was published.

Because of this study, the whole Aryan hypothesis collapsed. Because, firstly, the hypothesis was based on flimsy ground. There was no solid evidence. First some scholars said that Aryans (came from Central Asia) and killed [Harappan] people. Later, their opinion changed and they said large-scale migration took place because of which there was a change. People have been coming and going. The Mughals came, the British came.

But suppose the Aryans had come, two things would have happened. If they came from Central Asia, they could have brought with them their material culture and planted it here. That is human tendency. Like when we go and settle in America or Europe, we preserve our culture and heritage there. We don't forget our roots. Second, if they had [invaded] and killed the local people, then they could have [mixed with people and] introduced new genes in South Asia. There could have been breakage in the genetic history of South Asia. But it never happened. So, the Aryan invasion or Aryan migration theory collapses. People have come and gone. People have also settled here. They were absorbed into the Indian society. That is the base of Indian culture. Even the Mughals tried, but our roots never changed.

Q/ It was a contentious issue?

A/ That was a concocted story. The British wanted to divide and rule here. They wanted to justify that they had come from Europe to rule us. They would say: “You have been ruled by many people before also. So why you are making an issue out of that?” As people came from outside, they were the “advanced” people, they taught Indians everything. We have Rig Vedic texts, [and] I am trying to find corresponding archaeological evidence. I am getting it at the Harrapan level. The Saraswati river is frequently mentioned in the Vedic texts. It is mentioned that there are flourishing settlements in their cities in the Saraswati basin. We have evidence of fire worship from Kalibangan.

Q/ After the DNA study was published in 2019, some scholars criticised you for deviating from what was actually said in it, particularly your reference to the Aryan question.

A/ Let me clear that. We published two papers. There was a mention that after 2000 BCE, there is more inflow of people from Central Asia. It was by mistake, I accept that. We used the word Aryan there. It was said in a flow and it was a mistake on our part. That research was based only on genetics, but here I am using archaeological data also to understand the growth. Evidence indicates that Harappans began to go out to Iran and Central Asia.

Q/ Are you talking about the Out of India theory?

A/ We have found two sites—Shahr-i-Sokhta in Iran and Gonur in Turkeministan. Both sites were excavated and Harappan material was found there. They found skeleton remains and the DNA was extracted... This means that the Harappans began to go there and started mixing. More research is going on in different institutions and labs.

Q/ The absence of horses in the Harappan civilisation is often cited as proof that the Aryans did come from Central Asia and brought with them the animal.

A/ Now this issue is important. As far as the horse is concerned, the first site that was studied was Surkotada near Dholavira; Hungarian archaeo-zoologist Sandor Bokonyi said there were horse bones and a domesticated horse. On the other side, a group headed by Richard Meadow from Harvard University studied the same bones and said they were of a wild donkey. I go with Bokonyi as at Lothal and Mohenjo-daro, some figurines of horses have been reported.

Q/ What about Vedic gods?

A/ It was said that the Aryans invoked the Vedic gods. Shiva was found. Indra was worshipped. They did a lot of nature worship. Agni was worshipped.

Q/ Did caste have its origin in the Indus civilisation?

A/ No. It came later, some 2,000 or 2,500 years ago. It started when emperors like the Mauryans came. There was division of labour. So certain work was assigned to a particular group and it became the profession; they were thereon known by that profession only.