Interview/ Asim Arun, minister of state for social welfare, Uttar Pradesh
Q/ Did the organisers get permission from local authorities to hold a large gathering?
A/They apparently took permission for 80,000 people. The police told me that the organisers insisted they would take care of all the crowd handling. They have their band of volunteers called sewadars. The superintendent of police told me that some cops were deployed inside the venue, but they were predominantly used for traffic management outside.
Q/ What went wrong?
A/As much as I could understand from my interactions with the wounded and the cops there, when the vehicle with Bhole Baba was coming out of the venue, there was a huge crowd also moving towards the road. The road to be taken by such people (Bhole Baba) should have been separate from the road used by the crowd. Then something happened, which we will know only after the inquiry. The question is, why did the cars stop and why did the sewadars use force? I am told they used lathis to scare away people, and old women started falling. Then the stampede happened. The sewadars were not trained to use force and it is a matter of inquiry whether it was sheer negligence or something else.
Q/ What are the existing norms for such gatherings?
A/The norms are not very detailed. The chief minister (Yogi Adityanath) has asked for better norms to be framed under three heads. First, what are the civic amenities that a gathering of a thousand people or one lakh people would require? Second, there could be exigencies that could result in modifications to the programme, for example rain or storm. It needs to be seen whether the organiser is ready for that. And then there could be contingencies that need medical attention. So, the current standard operating procedures are not so detailed. We have to make it more effective.
Q/ Have Bhole Baba and his associates flouted norms in the past?
A/I am not aware of that, but seeing his older videos, one can suspect that similar arrangements were being made in the past.
Q/ The police have arrested some members of the organising committee. How is their role different from Bhole Baba, who has not been named in the FIR?
A/The permission for the event was not taken in his (Bhole Baba’s) name. Those who have been arrested were the ones who organised the event and worked as sewadars in charge of managing events, bringing crowds and collecting funds.
Q/ Is the role of Bhole Baba under investigation?
A/It is very much under investigation. The FIR was lodged against one person (only the main accused was named) and 70 to 80 others. So, the one person is the one who took permission for the function and the others would include the sewadars, and speakers like him (Bhole Baba) and his wife.